Zion Clark's Comeback Story

00:00:10 Speaker 1: Welcome back everybody. We are here for another episode of Comeback Stories than today's guest was born with no legs and was in eight foster care homes for the first seventeen years of his life. During that time, he suffered physical abuse, mental abuse, and starvation. But today he's an All American athlete, actor, musician, against world record holder, motivational speaker, entertainer, motivator, and so much more. Zion Clark, Welcome to the show. What's up? What's up? Man? Glad to have you man. Yeah, it's good to be here. You know, I think that this is my third time in Vegas. It's pretty cool to be out here. Every time I drive through, it's like I see something different. It's an interesting place. Yeah, I'm probably gotten up being here a lot more. I don't gamble, though, so don't waste the just crazy. You know. You think I'll go to Vegas go gambling. Yeah, I've never. I've never gambled in Vega. People just out here donating money. That's why we ain't got no income tax out here, because people just donating money into the slot machine. Right Hey, we like to dive right in. Can you tell us what growing up for you was like. Growing up was it was rough. You know, I'm not gonna get I don't like getting like digging into like real crappy details. But all in all, in the foster system, you know, there's a lot of abuse and there's a lot of mistreatment to a lot of these kids that get abused, and I was one of them, you know. I started right off, right off rip being born. A second I was born, coming out of hospital, I went to my first home, and after that just traveled all over the state of Ohio, all over parts of New York, all the way back to Ohio to Pennsylvania, you know, and it was each family was different, you know, and when it came to the hardships, you know, I was different, you know, and being different isn't something that's that you should look look down upon, but in my case, it was always looked down upon because I was the only person like myself in my city at that you know, there's only one out of every three hundred thousand kids are born with my condition each year, so that's not a lot of kids. So with that being said, all right, growing up was rough. I got bullied a lot too, and like in and out of school, and you know, I learned how to fight though, like along the way, and I've been doing that, and you know, I was sports opened up my kind of gave me like sentimental peace as a kid because I started when I was young. I started wrestling and stuff when I was five years old. So with that being said, I'm like it's been like a kind of like therapy. So when whenever there was anything bad, I got to go to the mat and blow offs team. And then as I've gotten order, it's kind of like I need to be training or I need to be doing something active just so I have peace of mind. And it works, and that's what's really like kept everything together. Can you explain to maybe someone that doesn't know your um the syndrome is called yeah, it's called Caudle regressing syndrome. Ah, And it's like it varies to from like person a person for whatever, you know, like whatever the level of severity that you have for this condition. Like in my case, I don't have legs. For some people there they have more parts of their spine missing, or they might have their full spine and like they might just have the tiniest peace missing and that's all. That's all it is and it doesn't do any damage or any harm, but still they have the condition. So it's like it goes from a level of just not very severe to real severe, which is would be I guess one of my cases, what's what's it caused from? All? Right? My case, my first mother did a lot of drugs, so like I was, like I would you call a crack baby pretty much, And so I had every party drug known a man in my system when I was born, So like I, I was more prone. I'm more prone to like like get addicted to a certain type of drugs. I did like something like really hard, and like I would, I would have a higher chance of being addicted just because I've already I was born with it in my system, you know, So like that's what caused my That's what caused my disability. But it can happen from any to any different ways. That's what makes it rare. You never know exactly what it's caused by. Every time we come from a world of addiction. Darren and I have both been sober for quite a while, and um, so this obviously hits home for sure. What was it like, what's the relationship Obviously if you're in foster care homes. Was when you came out and had those party drugs in your system? Is that when you were essentially taken from your mom? Yeah? Right, a right off rip. I was like the second I was born, I was placed in a foster care custody because she wasn't suitable to take care of me because like she was on drugs when she was when I was born. So uh yeah, you didn't mention anything when we talked about your childhood growing up. The obvious is you don't have legs, But what what was that like? And I mean you can go there a little bit. This has comeback stories and I think we asked that question first because it helps shape and connect the dots for why you do what you do and why and who you are today. You know, just like just like how most people have legs growing up, like the way I did, Like I just didn't have them. You know, I saw I saw other kids. I would see other kids running running around or riding bikes and so like I would struggle a lot, but like I would, I would figure it out. You know. I figured out how to walk on my hands by myself. I figured out how to ride a bike by myself. You know, it took me a long time. It took me a long time to figure out balance. It took me a long time to like get to the level where I'm at now, where I can pretty much move however I want to. But like as a kid, yeah, it was it was tough. You know, I was vastly different. I had to move differently. I had to I think, like from a perspective of looking up at everything, you know, that's that that that's my childhood. And if that makes sense, like imagine like here's like this kid like this, like this small as a kid, and you're just like looking up like the world. The world's huge, like when you're that, when you're that small. So you gotta learn, you gotta learn how to handle yourself, and you gotta learn how to move around. But like at the same time, just how I figured it out, what's the what's what's the difference if you took out the fact that I don't have legs, what's the difference between you figuring it out for me figuring out? It's not really any difference. I feel like arriving at that perspective probably wasn't the easiest thing to do when I'm sure there were not only people, but things around you that probably remind you of what you can't do. Who was who is somebody that early on helped you shape your perspective in a positive way to help you start to form a vision for your life. Definitely my coach that I had grown up through the wrestling program, him and his whole family. Actually they're they're family of wrestlers, some of the most elite people I know, honestly, and they taught me everything I know in the sport and taught me a lot of patience. I used to get frustrated, like real like upset, and I'd be like punching the mat, punching the ground, like just because I would lose or get I would worf. I just have my ass handed to me, you know. That's how I used to like I didn't I used to just not have any control. And the biggest thing for me is having like sense of stability, balance and like mental mental fortitude, and wrestling really helped build that for me. Well, my coach helped build that for me because he would he would push my buttons and push my limits, and once I would be in that like that state where I'm just like, just like you know, off the rails that he would like he would help me rein it in and control it. If that's like same, Like I can feel those I can feel those ways and like feel certain impulses, but like the difference between feeling and acting on And he taught me, like wrestling really taught me that difference. And he was a real big role model for me. And that because I used to just like I grew up in a hood a little bit coming up, and I used to I got this nasty thing about me when I was young, hour like if you made me mad, I punched you straight in the mouth, don't saying a word. If I didn't like how you were talking to me, I didn't like you weren't getting on my face, I would just either head buddy, or I punch you straight in your mouth. And I just used to be like a wild cannon. And I'm like and the reasons that I fight now is because like having moments like those, like learning from like being all the way back there and I was looking at myself as a professional fighter and as a professional athlete of general, It's like, wow, I don't even recognize that person, and I really credit that fortitude to that man because I didn't have a father growing up, and he I kind of looked at him as that father figure. It sounds like I'll circle back to a question I want to ask you, But a lot of the aggression comes from pain, right and punching someone in the mouth without even like thinking about it, is it's like a reaction right in the wrestling sounds so therapeutic because it's controlled aggression where you have to actually kind of manage it, but you're also able to use it as an outlet and move some of that energy and move through some of the shit that the repressed pain and all of the stuff that I'm kind of imagine that you went through in your younger years. But can you remember like what was like a real early memory of pain that you had? Shoot, Like, what kind of pain? Because I vividly remember crashing my own teeth in with a metal baseball bat by accident as a kid. I'm talking more emotional, yeah, like yeah, uh, I don't want to go into it because I don't like to talk about it, but it would be getting removed from my first home. I remember it vividly. How were you I was like three, it's it's probably a gift that you do remember it, because my understanding is a lot of the things that we don't remember. We're all just be having a conversation or coaching someone and or even in therapy. But like I don't remember my childhood, and oftentimes that's the brain's way of blocking out some of the pain. It's a way of like protecting. Yeah, the fact that you that you remember it. In the beginning, it probably wasn't a gift, and today it is. And I think one of your other gifts. And I want to bring Darren in on this because if you don't know Darren's story, Darren's core wound is being different. And I'll let him share a little bit more about that because you brought up you said that we're different a bunch growing up, right, That's that's who you were. I mean, I didn't say it necessarily, but I just didn't care. You know, if somebody like were to point, if somebody we're pointing and looking and like saying, like mom that that guy has no legs, like as a kid, I would get upset, but like I wouldn't be like going crazy about it. You know, it was where I was just the okay, cool, you're a kid. Like the way I saw it, You're a kid. I'm a kid. You got a problems with me, you know, like and I've always been like that, just people who wanted to always press buttons. So then people start getting hurt and either I would get beat up or somebody else would get beat up, you know, and like that's the type of reality I lived there. Yeah, so you have you have to build this like I not like I don't care attitude, but like you can't, like you have to build this like thinking about yourself where you can hear it. You can hear what they're saying, but are you going to absorb it? Like yeah, I know, like you don't want to absorb that type of energy from people, right, So it's almost like a balance of what you should and shouldn't give a fuck about. Yeah, Like it's it's you never like I don't give a fuck about anything. Then it's like you just out here kind of living reckless and like, yeah, you don't have any kind of like the balance between like given like giving a damn about this topic, but like at the same time, like not having a care free attitude going into it so you know, going in, don't come in with huge expectations, have big goals, but don't come in expecting to like be like top top dog right off it, because it don't work like that, you know. So just come in with like a peaceful, calm attitude, care free, but also have shit that you do care about and balance it out. Like me, I do a lot of cool things, and I'd like doing a lot of cool things for other people too, But at the same time, like I take care of myself and I don't like people. And that's so crazy what I'm saying that, but I'm just being real. I just I don't necessarily like being around a lot of people all the time, you know. And but at the same time, I inspire a lot of people, and I love putting my messages out there, you know, because there's a lot of life and a lot of truth into what I'm saying, and I hope people really jump onto what like what I gotta say. By the same time, I'd like to just do that and play my Xbox, you feel. I feel that for sure, because I mean, growing up, I you know, I was very very insecure in myself and just I feel like I found like some safeness and just isolation. Yeah, you know, you know it's so crazy because, uh, there's this saying you if you can feel comfortable by yourself when someone else comes into your life, like it helps creating that that boundary if you're not going to be codependent on that person, you know what I mean? Because the best, the best people that stay together, whether it's relationships or or like groups of people or a team, are the people that aren't just like solely dependent on somebody for a certain aspect in their life. If you can have a self self sense of freedom, then you can live on a broader spectrum, no doubt. How did you how did you cultivate that perspective and how did how did that serve you as you went on your journey through can't state like what was what was that? Like? Oh, I learned a lot of lessons, like all the time. Dude, I got my head kicked in my first college match. I was going up against the number four guy in the country and I was winning and I got cocky and then he pinned me while he was losing. Yeah, that was that was like a real first match of the season at home in front of a like a sold out crowd get just smacked. And that was one of those moments where I'm like, Okay, this is something he's something he's happened, because I was starting to get like this these feelings of back when I was in high school and I was getting my head kicked in and I was like, I don't I don't need that. Like I knew I had the ability, but like you had to learn, especially at Kent State, being a college athletes tough, being a college wrestlers even tougher. You know, it's it's it's a different standard of like doing things. You're up at four thirty in the morning and you're running around the track and it's dark outside and the stadium lights already even on, but coaches there and you know you can see you know, like like some real like they're like real real. Our coaches were so invested and like like getting us up and training our mental states, like getting us up early like that and making us drill for two hours in the morning before like the sun even come up. Like that's that is that's those like that, those are those hard moments and those hard lessons, and you know it made you are, it makes you made you made me appreciate the art of truly working hard. You know, in high school, I'd like I'd set myself up to get to college. You know. That was a start, and it was cool, like media attention, whatever. But once I actually got to college, man, I had a real like real big, like like eye open like all of a sudden, I wasn't living at home anymore, and I was broke, you know what I mean, Like, and I'm thinking, like, okay, what what what needs to happen so I can like still like keep myself looking. So in college, I got a job laying brick and I went to class and I went to practice twice a day, and I kind of got myself into a routine, and for a while, I just loved it, you know, and I felt good about myself. And plus I was I was like getting stronger from I was getting physically stronger from laying brick every day. And on top of that, I'm lifting in the weight room and I'm wrestling my teammates and doing extra stuff outside of class too. So it was it was just a different type of I didn't we had to you hit a different level of just competition, Like when you hit that different level of being an athlete. This is what like you can tell who's going to become a pro and who's like gonna fade because then like that college level is like that that final like kind of final phase of like, all right, where are you gonna go from here? What do you want to do? Is you're life from here? And so I really like I didn't I didn't know this was going to take me to be a pro fighter. I couldn't have guessed that five or six years ago while I was in college. Couldn't enough, no way, But I'm here now because sometimes you need lessons like that Moost. Lessons can take years out of time. Sometimes you need lessons like that to propel yourself forward. So when it comes to when it comes to rumble with the big dogs, you're ready, you know. Yeah, And I believe that there's time needed to really truly develop the foundation of character that's needed to be successful. Like a lot of people may want their hand raised high on that mat, but they don't want the discomfort that comes with all the training that you had to do lay in the brick and the mental toughness that's developed in that Like, you need those times you need to allow yourself to It's like a seed being planted. The roots had to grow underground where a lot of people won't be able to see it before it comes above ground. But a lot of people don't want that, Yeah, because people are scared. A lot of people are scared of the unknown, and wrestling is one of those things that you walk into a match, could have trained something a hundred times and it gets shut down first try, you know, Like that's how wrestling can work, and that that level of uncertainty is the reason why wrestling isn't for everybody, because wrestling is all about common like fighting physically fighting the unknown. You're you're you're you're not necessarily guessing, but more so reacting at very high paces like the snap of a finger like somebody could be on their head, you know. So it's different. It's a different level of awareness that you need to have, you know, and I'm not saying that like just for pros, like as I've seen I've seen kids with a type of awareness that I see in some professional athletes. You know something, there are some freak athletes out there, man, and like having that type of drive, like it's good like as an athlete, but like that's only gonna be like the first thirty years of your life and then you got yes, sixty more years ago. You know. So with that being said, but this, these things teach, these teach lessons, you know, as a wrestler, man, I learned a lot from life. I learn how a shotgun of beer through wrestling. By the way, this we're talking college, but right, you know, like I've been like in wrestling has putt me in so many different like positions that I've learned a lot of stuff about life as well as the art of the art that I practice. One thing you didn't mention with the being a college wrestler is cutting weight. I'm just curious like that that on top of being a call I don't have to cut much weight, you don't know, but the process of that or watching other teammates go through that, like what are the lessons there? I mean, I support it. I'm gonna I'm gone that they would wrestle with to cut with. I'd be like, all right, we're gonna go, We're gonna go into it. We're gonna do matt, We're both gonna get tired, you know. So we would sit there an hour, like two hours homies in a sweatsuit or just saying hellas sweats hoodies, and I'm just going we're just going crazy. And I'm like every time that he'd be like all right, trying to take a breath, I get on his head again and like that's how, That's how we helped each other. And like I'm turning that was helping me get better because they're pushing the pace too, because they want to be they want We all have the same objective at this point in time, you know. So we're all trying to get like like we're all trying to upgrade our skills, get better. You're trying to lose eight pounds, which I want nothing to do with. So I'm glad I'm staying underweight. But at the same time, I'm going to help you get that because I want to see you there with me. So you're at Kent State. At some point you have a decision to you come up with the decision that you want to leave. What what came to that decision? What did it take to find the courage to do it? Having fifty dollars in your pocket and and actually making that that that big, big change. Tell us about that man, It was it was extremely impossive. I'm gonna just say that for sure. But you know, there's a lot of good things happening in my life at that moment, and Kent State and NC double being under the NC double A and their rules restricted me from having access at least at the time to a lot of things, you know, and I was I felt like I was kind of being stuck and like I felt like I was kind of partially like owned by Kent State at that moment. Yeah, and you know, I was out here in California for like we I went to Ellen de General show and then I stayed out here because like my boy name is Joey Davis. He wrestled for Notre Dame of College in Ohio. He's a four time undefeated NC double, A chimp, dude's nasty, but he I was out here like training with him like every day for like two months, like out of the summer, and it was getting close to next year, and I was just just like, you know, like that's when I made up the mind. I was like, I want to pro fight. I want to be I want to be a professional fighter. Because he's now my boys currently an undefeated Weltroit in bellatour So I you know, I was inspired by him and my whole team. You know, that was That's what kind of really did it for me. You know, my coach and name is Antonio McKee and he was He told me, he said, if you're willing to like work, if you're willing to give me all you got, you can stay in my gym. And like, this man is ruthless. I've watched him kick somebody out of the gym and out of the gym in the middle of a practice. So like he's real serious about where he believes. And he's also one of the best coaches in the world when it comes to MMA, whether it's the UFC, Bellator or any league that there is. Like you want that guy in your corner. So really, like I was a kid at the time, man, so I was just like, yeah, like I want to do this. And so over the last couple of years, i'd like I would be coming back and forth. I was broke, like started like figuring out like speeches, had my boy Craig's help. He really started helping me like piece my stuff together, you know, and we started working as a team. And you know, my other guy Tony's help. We really just like I started just like you know, just like figuring out like what my purpose was, you know, because in college, I'm not gonna lie to you, I was training all the time, I was working all the time, and I was getting drunk on the weekends, and I was just kind of doing the same thing every weekend, you know. And even though yeah, I'm I'm a high level college athlete, I'm bored, you know, Like I was seriously like sick and tired of the same thing. And on top of that, there's a lot of other issues with Kent State that I had nothing against the school. I love the school, but like I just had my own personal issues that I couldn't overlook. So I had to make a decision. And I remember I was in California and I told him my mother that I am not going back to college. And I got cussed out on fun, you know, and rightly so, because I was almost done, you know. And the more I look back at it, you know, I talked to my mom about that decision I made, Like every once in a while she brings it up and she's like, you know, back to the end, She's like, I didn't want to speak to you because, like my mom, My mom's a real one, you know, she wants what's best for me and my sisters. And the fact that I was the first, like Clark in the family to go to college and drop out and I complete it. You know, everybody in my family's gone to college. I'm the first one to drop out, you know, and I felt like I definitely did things differently, and I think that's that's what was needed. You know, you're saying your mom, obviously it's not your birth mom. Is this your eighth foster care? No, No, this is just that's my mom, Mike. I wish we have the same last name, Like that's my mother, Kimberly Clark Hawkins. But this is your one of them. She adopted me, Like I like I'm part of Like that's my family. That was my sisters. Yea, but yeah, you should have seen he should have seen it. He should have seen her face on FaceTime that day when I I FaceTime Dare and I told her, I was like, Mom, I'm dropping out of college. Like so imagine you're in like high to your college career and like you just do that, and then you didn't tell your family yet they made a decision, then you tell him. Oh man. I was like, I thought I was about to get disowned from my family, honestly, but I was just like yeah, I mean, you know, I like but at the end of the day, I was like, you know, you know what like like effort, you know, like why like go see what happens. Worst case scenario, I reapply back for the decks like next term, next semester, you know that. Like that's how I was thinking. That was like five years ago. Look where I'm at. You know, it's not impossible. I heard a pastor listening to recently. He said, fear fear has burglarized more destinies than taking a risk ever has exactly you know, most people fear showing up. But like you know, sometimes all you gotta do is just show up, right, you know, step out in faith. Yeah, yeah, for real. No, I was sweaking. I was sleeaking. For a second, I was like sleeping on the Homies couch. I was sleeping on like I was like just house hopping, trying to stay out in California as long as I could to set at least something else I could keep coming back, And I did with the help of a lot of good people, got a good people that I got the pleasure of knowing. I've had the pleasure of knowing When did you start seeing momentum? Was there like a shift? Was it a slow build? I would say about like a lot of momentum in the last like two years. You know, COVID really completely squandered any plan that I had initially when it first started. You know, I was starting to really like get around the United States a few years ago before I before over, Like I spoke out here in Vegas at the f forty five World Convention, Like I did a lot of cool a lot of cool shit, and like it was really like the steam like it was hot for a second, you know what I mean. And I was like, Oh, We're about to take this to the moon. And then you know, COVID happened. And then within forty eight hours, I had no source of income, you know, and I was just like screwed. So I went back to Ohio again, and then with the help with my boy Crag, we figured out a plan. We started doing stuff and then over the time over the span of COVID, we've like we set up a lot of things that now with the world being pretty much opened back up. We got a lot of stuff cooking on the stove. You've been in a Netflix documentary and me award winning, Yeah, tell us about that. How long ago did that come out? Like three and a halfish years ago? Now, it was just a twelve minute, a little short documentary about my life. You know. They filmed it right after I was like after I got done with high school. Uh, you know, I got to speak on some of the things I went through with my mom, my coaches, like my kind of more like my inner circle of people. And yeah, I did not expect it to be as big as it is. I'm gonna be real about that. I thought it was just a little rinky dink project that you know, it was cool, Like I was like a high schooler, awesome rinky dinging project. I was more focused on getting in college, getting that call from Kent State, you know, like that's what I was focusing on. Every day. I was sitting there just like chilling by the phone. I wouldn't leave my house, you know, just because I wanted to see what was gonna happen. And then this thing happened, This Netflix, This Netflix stuff happens and It wasn't even like Netflix. It was a producer from New York City that came out hit me up on Facebook, and it was just a little like little like seven day project and then just nothing. Went to college a year and a half later, pulled like my coach hated me for this, pulled me out of a dual meet to fly me to Salt Lake City for the Sunday's Film Festival and when best one best Short Documentary there, and then proceeded to win Best Short Documentary at every single film festival across the United States and in most other countries. And then Netflix got their hands on it. So that was a cool little process. The whole time I'm in college, so I really didn't know what was going on. I was just kind of they tell me something, I'd be like, yeah, cool, you know, so like just cool stuff. Man. You know, I didn't have I didn't realize the effected have on people. But now that I'm older, I'm definitely like man like like the things that people have said coming up to me, like not to make myself feel better, but it feels good knowing that, like, you know, my actions not even without even saying anywhere. It's just my actions on what I'm doing is like having an effect on people. It's crazy to think about. To me sometimes you're really, yeah, it's it's crazy. I think the same thing with me, Like when I came out and starts sharing my story with my addiction, what I went through. I had no idea that I was giving people permission to pursue their path to greatness, no matter what was holding them back at the time or what kind of adversity they were facing. Like and I didn't realize that I had that kind of power. I didn't realize that I had that type of impact on the people in the world around me. But I mean that's how I really believe in guys, because like with all my best effort, it's like but with but with his help, as soon as the door was opened, like look at what my life has you come now, like through whatever, through the pit of my life, through what was the worst thing that could possibly ever happen to me, is now the reason why people have hope. And it's just like exactly that's that I could I could repeat that right back to you. Yeah, I messed with you, You're legit. Well, I think it's like Darren and I was coming from the world of addiction. It was self inflicted. I mean, we can when we could blame blame it on whatever, but it's really like I know, we've talked about this, our lives really started to ship and we took ownership of it and just own it. Took personal responsibility to just like own our past, but yours wasn't necessarily self inflicted. But the bottom line is worth three of us sitting up here, three men that are just really we don't know the impact that we're actually having, and because of technology and podcasts, like we don't know who we're reaching. It does feel good to get those messages. It's not validation, it's just reaffirming. Yeah, it's just we're just inspiring people. So it's not an ego thing like don't like, don't tell me that you're not gonna smile when somebody tells you that you've helped them get up off their feet, you know what I mean, Like naturally, Yeah, if you're not if you don't feel good that you did something positive, why are you doing you know, it's not it's obviously not positive if you don't feel good about it, you know, but like it's at some level even if it's something that makes you wildly uncomfortable to share. At some level, you're doing it for a reason, and you're doing it not to make yourself feel good, but to raise somebody else's more out and raise their spirits so they can get motivated and get up off there, get up off their feet and do some do some amazing shit. So then you decide you want to be a profighter. Yeah, you just recently, it was fairly recently had your first Yeah, that was like December seventeen one by unanimous decision thirty to thirty, twenty seven decision. Is that something that you're you're continuing to do or oh yeah, yeah, oh yeah. I was just on the phone my coach the other day yesterday, actually looking at other options and old boy that abbe wants to fight me again. So maybe I'll like knock his ass out this time. If he wants to do like a trilogy or something, his ego might be hurt. Just oh, it definitely is gonna hurt even worse. Again. What are some of the practices like to keep your mindset strong? What we talk about rituals and practices, morning routines, like what is your I feel like you got a pretty discipline dialed in system. What does that look like? I mean I don't necessarily meditate, you know, fighting and stuff is my meditation. I can put all my energy into, all this negative energy into learning how to sharpen my skills, and like I feel good about myself and I feel like I make clear more clear headed, clear headed decisions to move forward, you know. But like on the other hand, like I don't know, I like microdocing strooms too, Like the microdoces helped me like clear my head. Same, it's like so it's like I'm meditating but like actively moving, but like with the calms with no like hallucinations, no doubt. I mean, your your life can be a meditation as long as, yeah, as your present to the moment and fully immersed in whatever it is you're doing. Wrestling, yeah, walking, hiking like no matter. Yeah, it's more conscious, like I like taking I like doing in the microdocing when I'm really trying to like think on certain aspects, you know, because like so the micro doss with health, like the health practices, it helps with like PTSD, it helps with anxiety, it helps you like really on the most like most healthiest natural sense stay like calm, you know, and I'd like to see it more and more places because with my with my um, with me using it, I've seen a lot of changeing how I think, just kind of like you know, it's like there's different forms, like some like higher form of meditation you can get from like different practices, you know, like for instance, I definitely would I'm definitely wanting to do a ayahuasca and really like search my like mind's eye and figure out what I, like I truly want to do, you know, like that would I would love to have some clearness like that. I'm glad you're talking about this because we've we both talked about it and haven't even in our sobriety we call I call it a sobriety. Two point zero nine years sober, did my first mushroom journey, a big hero's journey. But before I did it, my my teacher and friend now Christie. Shout out Christie, She's been such a tremendous impact on my life. Had me microdose before I did the big journey, and so this is the first thing I put in my system after nine years, the microdose, and I was like, oh my god, this is what every antidepressant should be. Yeah, the antidepressants make you feel like craps. I don't know why people sell them exactly when there's natural things that come out to the ground that could be perfectly suitable. That was that moment I had. I was just like a little bit happier, a little bit more clarity of walking in pag and I'm like, oh my god, and this is a plant exactly, you know, a very very intelligent plant. Yeah, but yeah, no, that's how that's how I get my minds either fight or I do that. And it's like it keeps me like I feel like real solid, like you like you see me do more of my like the more like when you see me do something really dope. It's because I was probably really focused and really like felt really clear. When I'm not clear, you don't see me do a lot of stuff, you know. And then that's when I need to That's when I need to find like figure out for myself, like I need to, Okay, I need to tune back in. I need to make sure I need I need to keep on what I was doing because you know, you don't want to let anything die out. So like you guys, sometimes anchor yourself back, keep yourself in place. Big facts. I love I love the title work with what you got? Yeah? What? Um? How has that become a sort of a mantra for you and people that you helped, because I feel like that's such a good perspective to have no matter where you're at in a particular journey. Yeah, so work was what you got? I think of me like this. The world is always going to be a shitty place. Don't be a shitty person. Work with what you got. Take everything that you have in front of you. If it's if it's crap, turn into something good. You know, I mean, you have the power to change that, you know what I mean. So you you work with the things around you, and you don't live by the way of the world. You live by the way of yourself. When you say that, I hear acceptance, right, Yeah, we talk about it in recovery. Acceptance is the answer to all of our problems. It's accepting. It doesn't mean you have to like it or think it's fair, but you do have to accept it because it's happened, right, And that acceptance, there's a there's a whole lot of freedom there and just being able to um, yeah. And then as as we gain more tools and stay in this work, the work and the impact it raises even more because you have more tools, too much. That's given comes great responsibility. So to work with what you got, Like tools that we had ten years ago was like nothing compared to we have now. Oh yeah. So it's a constant, accountable reality action of like leveling up your game. Like we have more we have more access. The people that we get to have conversations with make us better people and create more awareness. So it's just like continuous, continuously leveling up. Absolutely, that's all. That's what it is. You know. My book, you know, it shows the journey of me leveling up from the crappiest situations as I've progressively got older, as I've leveled up all these different things in my life. It's made is so you can see it, you know, that's exactly what, Like the book tells the story. If you close your eyes and have someone read the book to you, you can, like almost you can, I wanted to. It's gonna be in a way that you can visualize what is happening in those moments, so you can see the amount of growth. The amount of suffering, the amount of adversity, you know what I mean. And I'm just working with the tools that are laid on in front of me, just navigating, navigating life and navigating people, navigating different situations and trying to just survive. Hands work with what you got. Hey, my boy looks to me like you're doing a lot more than just surviving. Yeah, I'm thriving. I feel like I'm thriving now for sure. That's all we all want to do is thrive. I think I'm working with what you got. Also, just staying on that. It's like the it's the action step, right, it's the tools. You have to work with the tools that you have. But the tools only work if you use them. Yeah, and the more that you use them, the more that you're sharpening sharpening your tools, right, or you gain more tools in your toolbox. But what would you say to somebody out there that maybe knows they're struggling. They might be making a lot of excuses. I always like to say, when you stop making excuses, you start making changes. But maybe they're just stuck. They're stuck in the story and the bullshit. Um, what would you say to that person? I would say, you know, it's not as bad as you think. Look at what you keep getting stu and like meditate on it, you know what I mean? Like for I used to have like this mental block and wrestling and I was stuck Like Lou, I lost over two hundred times I talk about being stuck. That's eight years of being stuck losing. And you gotta just learn, like you gotta like calm down, sit back, analyze the situation. Look at what exactly your problem is. Don't look at what the overall problem is. Look at the exact moment that the problem occurs. What is going on, what's your what's your mental state? Like, what's your what? What's what? What's physically happening? You know what I mean? Have to like change the way that you process the situation. You might come out with a different outcome. But the key fact to that is the stay calm, because the more stress, the more stress you're having your brain, the more of a block you're gonna get. Yes, it's such about embracing the difficulty, which is, you know, in our human nature, it's not something that we want to do, don't We don't want to sit with what's that fear? We don't want to sit with that insecurity. We don't want to sit with that mistake that we continue to keep making because we feel like if we sit with it long enough, it means that we fail. It means that we're a failure as opposed to failure being an event that's not a person. Yeah, And I don't I need people to understand that more because I don't get it. Like feeling happens. I feel, I feel it shit even now, it's like I'm not I'm not perfect, you know, So it's not failure. When someone's like, I'm a failure, I was like, no, you just failed. You want to fail to task, but you yourself, you're not a failure. If you were a real failure, that means that you can never complete that task even if you try. But just because you fail doesn't mean that you can't try it again and again and again and again. It's all about growth, right, I Mean that's what I don't even really like using that word failure because I don't even think it is. It's not even a thing unless we identify it, right, Because if we're learning and growing from the failure, then it's not failure. It's growth. Yeah, it's learning and that's what we're here to do, learn and grow every day. That's that whole idea of a growth mindset. But it's when we judge ourselves or identify ourselves or attached to an outcome because we fail that something, we're a failure. That's a that's just a B S story exactly, And that's what people need to get on that. People definitely need to start thinking that. A lot of people also need to start thinking about when they, like I say they have a job or say that, like you're stuck and you're have to go do the same thing every day. Don't be like I have to go to work. I get to go to work. I get to go train. I hate training, but I get to go train. You know what I mean? Just verbally saying that could potentially alter your alter your mindset. So how you think about it, like like in the most literal sense, speaking it into existence. Donny, what's the what's the stats on when you speak something out loud? Oh? Yeah, so when you say something out loud, it's ten times more powerful. And if you just think it, and if you say something negative out loud, it's another seven times more powerful. So saying negative things out loud are seventeen times more powerful. But whatever. So I was on TMC and they asked me, how do you feel about you? Gem right, So this is like negative but positive for me. So I'm gonna rip his throat out and then I want that's not negative. I'm thinking more negative thinking for judgment towards You're just being real, you're manifesting. Okay, that's a belief system. The negative is like the beating up ourselves. Basically, yeah, no, that's I don't like to, you know, And like, here's the thing. It's okay to beat yourself up over something. You know, I do it. But here's the thing. At the same time, you can like don't necessarily beat yourself up more than you can critique your own performance and then get up and move on, you know, Like that's it's as simple as that. But it's it's a lot. It's a lot. It's harder done than said. Right, there's a conviction of knowing, like I know there's a higher level in me and um and that conviction is what's gonna allow me to get there. So I have to feel something to want to propel me to that other level because if I don't, I'm just gonna stay in that. I'm gonna stay right where I'm at, which is where I do not want to be. Yeah, it sounds more like accountability, just keeping yourself accountable. Oh yeah, that's why I have no excuses on my back because that's what it is. Hold myself accountable. If I did something badd hell yeah I did that shit, so I'm sorry. But like if I just something good, hell yeah I did that shit, You're welcome. You know what I mean. Like, I just keep yourself accountable for your actions, even like try to make good actions, but like, keep yourself accountable, keep yourself accountable at all times, and keep the others around you accountable too. That's how you build a strong system and better hope that those same people keep you accountable. I love that because more more layers of accountability you have, more likely you are to follow through and succeed on it. And then I believe accountability is the most radical act of self love, keeping the promises you make to yourself. Just do the things. Absolutely. There's so many times you hear someone say I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna be a champ at this or something, and you don't see it happen, and they just disappear and they fall off. It's like like, like you just said, where's that conviction? M ship? My man? You had who knows how many opportunities to make an excuse along the way in your journey, and you didn't. And we want to thank you for continuing to make that decision to rise above. And I'm sure there's millions of people out there that have been touched by you in that feel the same way. Bro, So appreciate you making time for the showman. Absolutely, I appreciate you guys having me on here. It's been fun. I love this setup, honestly, it's really cool. Yeah, man, thank you, Thank you so much for showing up, shining your light and really being an inspiration for others. I know I'm inspired and straight up absolutely ready to go crush it. So thanks again, brother. Absolutely, man, you're awesome. All Right, we're out. What's up? Comeback stories, family, It's Donnie dropping in here. So did you know that Darren and E's relationships started by me being his personal development, mindfulness and mindset coach. I want to let you know about both my one on one coaching program, The Shift and my group Mastermind Elevate your Purpose. These coaching programs are specifically designed for people who are ready to take the next step in their purpose and level up their career, personal finances, and have more connected, deep and meaningful relationships. My gift and part of my purpose is to help others take that next step and leveling up their lives so that they can have a greater impact on the lives of others, creates success that sustainable yet evolves and grows, and help build a legacy that will outlive your life. If this is calling you, just go to Donnie Starkins dot com and apply for either one of my programs.